MR. PANOSH: Investigator Rich, please. Inspector Rich. I'm sorry.

THE COURT: You may stand and stretch awhile, if you'd like, members of the jury, while the witness is coming to the stand.

265

EDWARD RICH, being first duly sworn, testified as follows during DIRECT EXAMINATION by MR. PANOSH:

Q    Would you state your name, sir.

A    Edward Rich.

Q    And your occupation?

A    I'm a supervisor with the Guilford County Department of Emergency Service. I supervise the fire investigation and inspection unit.

Q    How long have you been the supervisor of the fire inspection unit?

A    Since 1990.

Q    In the course of your training, did you receive special training in arson investigation?

A    Yes, sir, I have.

Q    And specifically, where did you receive your special training?

A    The North Carolina Justice Academy in Salemburg, and the National Fire Academy in Emmitsburg, Maryland, as well as a number of other seminars throughout the state.

Q    When did you attend the justice academy? A    I really don't remember. It was the first class held.

Q    Okay. A number of years ago?

A    Several years ago.

Okay. And then you went to the national school where?

A    National Fire Academy in Emmitsburg, Maryland.

 266

Q    And in the course -- after you received that training, you've had specialized training in the form of seminars; is that right?

A    Yes, sir.

Q    And who's put on those seminars, sir?

A    The North Carolina Fire Commission and the community colleges program throughout the state.

Q    And approximately how many fires have you investigated in the course of your career?

A    Several hundred. I really don't -- I don't have a record of how many I've kept.

Q    Have you had specialized training in determining the origin of fires?

A    Yes, sir, I have.

Q    And have you had specialized training in distinguishing accidental from set fires or arson?

A    Yes, sir.

Q    And have you been recognized as an expert in the field of arson investigation in the state of North Carolina?

A    Yes, sir.

Q    Have you been recognized in any other courts?

A    Yes, sir.

Q    What -- where was that?

A    Right here in Superior Court, Greensboro.

MR. PANOSH: Your Honor, we'd tender him to the

 267

Court as an expert in the field of arson investigation.

THE COURT: Do you wish to examine his

credentials, gentlemen?

MR. LLOYD: No objection, Your Honor. We'll stipulate he's an expert in the field of fire investigation.

THE COURT: The Court will find that he's an expert in the field of arson investigation by training, education and experience, and may express an opinion in that area.

Q    In the course of your duties, did you respond to Brandon Station Court on October the 9th of 1995?

A    Yes, sir, I did.

Q    And what was the purpose in responding there?

A    I was notified by our communication center that my assistance was needed on the fire -- scene of a fire in the Pleasant Garden fire district on Brandon Court -- Brandon Station Court. And I immediately responded to that call, as a result of that information being received.

Q    And you are basically the arson investigator for all of Guilford County, or one of them?

A    Yes, sir. Our office does investigative work for the fire service in Guilford County, for the entire county service.

Q    And you're the chief of that office?

A    Yes, sir.

268

Q    When you responded, did you have any assistance?

A    When I arrived on the scene, the sheriff's department was already on the scene.

Q    Did there come a time when you got anyone else from your office involved in the investigation?

A    Yes, sir.

Q    Who was that?

A    Eddie Harris, Garrett Stonesifer.

Q    And when did they respond?

A    The next day.

Q    You did the investigation at the fire scene on October the 9th; is that correct?

A    That is correct.

Q    And you took off -- took over the investigation as soon as the firefighters pulled out; is that right?

A    That is correct.

Q    And what did you do first in the course of your investigation?

A    Upon arriving on the scene, I communicated with the chief officer in charge, as to what he had found and what the status of the case was at that point. Once that was done, I began a thorough investigation of the scene, to determine the origin and cause of this fire.

Q    How did you start that, sir?

A    The basic search of an investigation, as far as fire is

269

concerned, is to start with the least amount of damage to the property and work within, so that you end up at the point of origin at which the fire started.

Q    And describe the way you conducted your investigation as to this particular residence.

A    As I approached the house, I was able to observe the exterior of the house, which the windows and doors were broken out or still intact, what entry the fire service had made, or what entry had been made by anyone other than the fire service. After doing this, I began an interior investigation, by going in the back room -- excuse me, the back door, and proceeding as the firefighting crews had entered, went through the entire house, looking for anything that would be of an unusual nature, as far as the fire is concerned.

Q    And what did you notice?

A    I noticed that the house had been ransacked or what I would consider to have been ransacked in the master bedroom and what I described as the study in the rear. The rest of the house had sustained what I would consider to be normal fire or intense heat damage, due to the firefighting operations and the fire itself, with the exception of what I discovered to have been a pour pattern.

Q    Would you indicate on the diagram the rooms that you determined to have been ransacked.

270

(The witness approached the diagram.)

A    The master bedroom, this rear bedroom here. (Indicated.)

Q    And the rest of the house had no such evidence?

A    None that I was able to observe.

Q    Resume your seat. Thank you, sir.

(The witness returned to the witness stand.)

Q    You talked about a pour pattern. What are you referring to?

A    Excuse me?

Q    You mentioned a pour pattern. What are you referring to?

A    That was a pattern in which the perpetrator of this crime actually caused the fire to occur, spread. It was poured upon the kitchen, the living room, and in the hallway.

Q    Based upon your initial observation there, did you make a tentative conclusion as to what accelerant was used?

A    Yes.

Q    And what was that conclusion?

A    Flammable liquid.

Q    And was there a flammable liquid container found?

A    Yes, sir.

Q    And what was in there, if you know?

A    At that point, I did not know.

271

Q    You didn't examine the container?

A    No, sir.

Q    Was there any distinct smell at the time you were doing the investigation?

A    Yes, sir, there was.

Q    And what was that smell consistent with?

A    The smell was consistent to me to be gasoline.

Q    Where did you observe the pour pattern?

A    Shall I show it on the diagram?

Q    That would be fine.

(The witness approached the diagram.)

A    As I was entering the kitchen room here, you could observe pour patterns in the kitchen, and come down between the furnishings in the kitchen -- or excuse me, the living room, from the kitchen, went across the couch that was in the living room area and went down -- (Indicated.)

Q    Let me interrupt. Could you put them on with a red pen.

(Mr. Panosh handed a pen to the witness, and the witness complied.)

THE COURT: Have you got a magic marker or bigger _ marker?

Q    Is there a red one there that's bigger, right -­(The bailiff indicated.)

A    Yes.

272

Q    Thank you.

(The witness complied.)

THE COURT: Can you see that better, the jurors? (Jurors nodded their head up and down.)

Q    And I believe there was a couch that was involved?

A    The couch was right here. (Indicated.)

Q    Can you resume your seat. Thank you, sir.

(The witness returned to the witness stand.)

Q    After your initial observations and noting the pour pattern, what did you do?

A    At that point, I backed out of the -- in the interior, and I waited until the sheriff's department's detective and ID units arrived on the scene, as part of our standard procedure for this type of fire.

Q    At this point, had the body been found?

A    Yes.

Q    And how did you go about locating the body?

A    As I went down the hallway, in the center of the area, which I've drawn in red, the body was found laying face down in the crawl space of the house, which is actually burned through the flooring.

Q    How was the body removed?

A    We had to pick the body up with gloves on, and take it outside.

Q    Was the body in any way covered or access to the body

273

in any way prevented?

A    Well, at that point, we covered the body, until we were able to remove it, because it was still hot, so we had to wait until it was cool. So we covered it with a sheet and then removed the body with the sheet to the outside.

Q    Was there any debris on top of the body?

A    Yes.

Q    What type of debris was on top of the body?

A    Ceiling insulation and materials that was in the room above the burned-out area.

Q    Now, after you removed the body, did you continue the investigation?

A    Yes.

Q    And how did you do that?

A    We were able to determine, based on the location of the body, that the fire had actually burned through the floor and fell down on the metal duct work beneath the house crawl space.

Q    When you say "through the floor," what do you mean?

A    The body had actually burned through the flooring of the house and fallen down to the crawl space.

Q    Okay. And what was the flooring composed of?

A It was composed of floor materials which is normally found in a structure of this type, wood with floor joists and supports, as well as the carpet or materials laying on

274

top of the floor.

Q    Was the hallway in the location of the body carpeted or hardwood?

A    I do not recall.

Q    And there was subflooring?

A    There was subflooring in there, as well as floor joists holding the floor up.

Q    And the floor joists were what size?

A    Between eight to 10 inches, at least.

Q    And the -- I take it then the fire had gone through the flooring, the subflooring and the floor joists, and then the body had fallen down?

A    Correct.

Q    Did you continue your investigation the next day?

A    Yes, sir, we did.

Q    And what did you do in the course of the investigation the next day?

A    We removed samples of material within the structure, to determine if at all possible what accelerant was being used by the lab.

Q    And when you say "the lab," you submitted them to the State Bureau of Investigation; is that correct?

A    Yes, sir.

MR. PANOSH: May I approach?

THE COURT: Yes.

275

Q    I'll show you now State's Exhibit 21. Do you see that, sir?

A    Yes.

Q    And what does that show, sir?

A    That shows the fire area as I observed it the night of the fire.

Q    And did there come a time when a ladder was placed over that area, so that firefighters and officials could cross the hole?

A    Yes.

Q    And also, there's a tape measure in there; is that right?

A    That is correct.

Q    And you were able to determine the size of the hole; is that correct?

A    At that point, we did.

Q    Okay. And what was the size of the hole?

A    I don't have that information.

Q    Okay. In the course of your investigation, did you uncover the body, by removing the debris?

A    Yes, I did.

Q    And I'll show you now State's Exhibits 41 through 44. Do you see those photographs?

A    Yes.

Q    And do those show the way the body was uncovered?

276

A    It shows the position of the body as we found it.

Q    Okay. And in order to find the body, you had to remove certain items; is that correct?

A    May I see that picture?

(Mr. Panosh handed an exhibit to the witness.)

A    This was taken from underneath the house -‑

Q    Okay.

A    -- under the crawl space. The body had not been moved at that point.

Q    You're referring to State's 44?

A    Yes.

MR. PANOSH: Your Honor, we'd seek to introduce into evidence State's 41 through 44.

THE COURT: The Court'll allow the introduction of State's Exhibits 41 through 44.

Q    And showing you then 46 and 47, are those photographs of the body after it's been removed, and I think it was taken to the garage area?

A    That is correct.

MR. PANOSH: The Court would seek to introduce 46 -- the State would seek to introduce 46 and 47, please.

THE COURT: The Court'll allow the introduction of 46 and 47.

MR. PANOSH: Your Honor, at this point, there's a series of photographs that need to be marked in reference to

277

his investigation. If you would consider a break, that would make it easier.

THE COURT: All right, sir.

You may step down, Officer Rich.

(The witness left the witness stand.)

THE COURT: Members of the jury, we'll take our afternoon recess. It'll be a 15-minute recess. Please remember the Court's instructions.

Everyone remain seated, while the jury leaves first.

(The jury left the courtroom at 3:16 p.m.)

THE COURT: You may declare a 15-minute recess. MR. PANOSH: Your Honor, before we -‑

(Time was allowed for the jurors to leave the jury room.)

MR. PANOSH: There was a videotape taken of this particular part of the investigation, and the State would like to use that, instead of using still photographs.

Counsel's previewed it, right?

(Mr. Lloyd nodded his head up and down.)

THE COURT: All right. How long will it take to set it up?

MR. PANOSH: Set it up, five minutes. It runs probably 10 or 12 minutes.

THE COURT: All right. Have it set up when we come back.

278

MR. PANOSH: All right. Do we need to view it, before we bring the jury in, counsel?

THE COURT: I believe they said they've already seen it.

(Mr. Lloyd and Mr. Panosh conferred.)

MR. PANOSH: I just didn't want to show it, without --

THE COURT: I think they've indicated they had no problem.

MR. PANOSH: Thank you.

(A recess was taken at 3:18 p.m.)

(Court reconvened at 3:34 p.m. The defendant was present. The jury was not present.)

THE COURT: Ready to proceed?

MR. LLOYD: Your Honor -‑

THE COURT: Yes, sir?

MR. LLOYD: -- if I may, over the break, we -- Mr. Hatfield and I had a conference. We spoke to our client. There are parts of this video -- the bulk of it we don't object to, but there are parts where they actually got the body out, and those are very graphic. And we'd simply ask -- we filed a motion on this earlier, Your Honor. We'd simply ask that the Court preview that part, see if the Court finds it's acceptable.

THE COURT: I offered to do that before we took

279

the break. I was willing to stay here and watch it. And you told me you'd seen it and didn't have any problem with it.

MR. LLOYD: Well, we talked it over with our client, Your Honor. I apologize.

THE COURT: How many parts are objectionable? Is that the only part?

MR. LLOYD: Basically the only part, Your Honor.

THE COURT: Turn it around and give me a preview.

MR. PANOSH: It'll take awhile, Your Honor.

THE COURT: How long is it going to take?

MR. PANOSH: It's -- I'll try to fast-forward to that portion of it, Your Honor.

THE COURT: All right, sir.

(Mr. Panosh fast-forwarded the videotape.)

THE COURT: Is there any narrative to this thing? It's just -‑

MR. PANOSH: There's no narrative. I'm going to ask Inspector Rich to explain the efforts that they -‑

THE COURT: Did he make the video or someone under his direction?

MR. PANOSH: Excuse me?

THE COURT: Did he make the video or someone under his direction?

MR. PANOSH: He's -- Yes. He's in the video.

280

THE COURT: All right, sir.

MR. PANOSH: This is where we start to show the body in the hole, and then they go on to look at some of the rooms.

(Mr. Panosh fast-forwarded the videotape.)

MR. PANOSH: All right. This will be Investigator Rich as you see him. He's starting the body removal now. (Mr. Panosh fast-forwarded the videotape.)

MR. PANOSH: This shows him removing the debris on top of the body.

(Mr. Panosh fast-forwarded the videotape.)

MR. PANOSH: This shows the fire damage to the body.

Shows her watch.

Damage to the lower limbs.

THE COURT: Do you have photographs of the body, also?

MR. PANOSH: Yes, sir.

THE COURT: Are they going to be -- how are they going to be, similar to this or what?

MR. PANOSH: I'll show them to Your Honor. (Mr. Panosh handed photographs to the Court.)

THE COURT: Are these the only three -- two?

MR. PANOSH: Those are the only two that we've put in evidence, yes, sir.

281

THE COURT: The coroner's going to use these, or is he?

MR. PANOSH: I don't know what the coroner's going to use. They bring their own.

THE COURT: All right.

MR. LLOYD: My understanding is, they have their own, Your Honor.

THE COURT: All right, sir.

(Mr. Panosh continued to play the videotape.)

MR. PANOSH: This is the -‑

THE COURT: Sir?

MR. PANOSH: This is the end of it.

THE COURT: All right.

Do you wish to be heard?

MR. LLOYD: Just briefly, Your Honor. I think the problem -- my problem with the video, Your Honor, is, it's much more visceral than the photographs, and I don't see anything in the video that Inspector Rich can't testify to, using the still photographs. Or if he needs to, certainly he can use the first part of the video, where the body is simply in the hole. My objection, Your Honor, is after the body is pulled out of the hole, and just the whole process. And then the video goes on and on with repeated close-ups and shots of a different part of the body.

If there was some question as to how she died, I

282

could understand the relevance of it, Your Honor, but I think basically, the way it is now, it simply inflames the passion of the -‑

THE COURT: It's simply trying to show the location and condition of the body and the position it was in.

MR. LLOYD: Well -‑

MR. PANOSH: Your Honor, we'll agree to showing it being removed from the body -- from the hole, and after a few seconds of an overall, stopping.

THE COURT: All right. The Court will find that that had rele-- is relevant and its probative value would outweigh any prejudicial aspect for that.

MR. LLOYD: All right. And that's fine, Your Honor, if Mr. Panosh is willing to do that. I don't -- my preference is, to show the initial video, where the shot shows the body in the hole, Inspector Rich is going to say, "There's the body in the hole."

THE COURT: It's their burden to show

premeditation and deliberation of a felony murder, and I think these photographs illustrate the position and location of the body, how it was found, and the condition it was in. They're entitled to show that.

MR. LLOYD: All right. I just wanted to make my position clear, Your Honor.

283

THE COURT: The Court finds that the photographs

-- or the video is relevant, and that the probative value

would outweigh any prejudicial aspects to showing the video. Bring them back.

MR. PANOSH: Could we wait until I get set up, Your Honor?

THE COURT: Yes, sir.

Wait just a minute.

(Time was allowed for Mr. Panosh.)

THE COURT: Bring them back.

You may return to the witness chair, Officer Rich. (The witness returned to the witness stand.)

(The jury entered the courtroom at 3:44 p.m.)

(Further time was allowed for Mr. Panosh.)

MR. PANOSH: Your Honor, we've marked the

videotape as State's Number 48. We'd seek to admit it into evidence.

THE COURT: The Court'll allow the introduction.

MR. PANOSH: We'd ask permission of the -- for Inspector Rich to come down and narrate the videotape of the investigation.

THE COURT: You may step down, sir.

MR. LLOYD: Object on the grounds previously raised, Your Honor.

THE COURT: Overruled.

284

(The witness approached the television monitor.)

CONTINUED DIRECT EXAMINATION by MR. PANOSH:

Q    Would you be careful now not to turn your back on the jurors, and go ahead and narrate the videotape, and use any comments that you feel are necessary.

THE COURT: Some of the jurors can't see. They're going to have to move.

If you need to stand up and move around, members of the jury, you may do that.

(Some jurors moved.)

THE COURT: Can all the jurors see now?

(Jurors nodded their head up and down.)

THE COURT: Proceed.

(The witness played the videotape to the jury.)

A    This is the front portion of the house, as we were standing in the front yard, looking at the full-face view of the residence. Firefighters standing at the door. And this is the open carport to our immediate left.

(The videotape stopped playing.)

Q    Something wrong?

A    I didn't touch nothing.

(Time was allowed for Mr. Panosh.) (The videotape continued playing.)

A    This is standing inside of the carport, the open area.

And you can see the area there hadn't been completely

285

finished, as far as construction. (The videotape stopped playing.)

A    Mr. Panosh.

Q    All right.

THE COURT: Go out and get a 10-year-old student up here to run this thing.

THE WITNESS: That'd be fine.

(Further time was allowed for Mr. Panosh.)

(The videotape continued playing.)

A    This is the rear door that leads into the kitchen from the open-ended garage.

(The videotape stopped playing.)

MR. PANOSH: Your Honor, I'm going to just hold off on this. There's something wrong with the machine. Perhaps we can do it later.

(The jurors returned to their seats, and the witness returned to the witness stand.)

(The clerk conferred with the Court.)

THE COURT: Let her come operate it.

MR. PANOSH: Can you do it?

THE CLERK: I'll check it later.

THE COURT: She said you got two buttons pushed at the same time.

THE CLERK: It could be that the -‑

MR. PANOSH: Huh?

286

THE CLERK: Have you got the pause button pushed with the fast-forward button?

MR. PANOSH: I'll be happy to get any help I can.

THE CLERK: I'll check it later.

MR. PANOSH: Do you want to try it now?

(Time was allowed for the clerk.)

(The clerk conferred with Mr. Panosh.)

(The witness approached the monitor. The clerk and the witness conferred.)

THE CLERK: Don't hit that one.

THE WITNESS: Don't hit that one?

THE CLERK: Unless you want -- unless you want it to stop. Hit pause if you want it to stop.

(Some jurors moved.)

(The witness continued playing the videotape to the jury.) A    Okay. We're inside the kitchen now, looking at the damage that was done by the fire, showing the interior structure as it existed at that point. This is showing the pour patterns, the burn patterns to the flammable accelerants that had been poured on the floor.

And this is just fall-down debris, which has been knocked down for various reasons, firefighting. There were actually pressure within the residence that was built up as a result of the fire.

All of the pink debris that you see in this video will

287

be actually the ceiling above the room. As you can see, the rafters there had not burned over the hole. But all the ceiling had fall down. And on top of that sheetrock ceiling, there was insulation, just well -- well insulated that pink material.

This is looking as I was standing in the living room, looking down the hallway. The master bedroom is to the far end of this, to our left. This doorway here is a full bath. This area right here that you see is a laundry room that was adjacent to the hole that burned. It had the washer and the dryer. And this material here is actually the rack, clothes rack that was above that. All that debris had fallen down and was actually laying partially on the body down in the hole.

This ladder was placed there by the Pleasant Garden Fire Department, to access the rear of the house, for the extension of the fire, and to make sure that it wasn't going to flare back, and also aided in our investigation, so we wouldn't have to crawl down in the hole and crawl back up, we just walked across the ladder, before it was removed.

THE WITNESS: Hit play?

(The clerk nodded her head up and down.)

THE WITNESS: Play.

(The witness complied, and the videotape continued playing and then stopped playing.)

288

(The witness conferred with the clerk.)

(Time was allowed for the clerk.)

THE CLERK: Apparently the machine is locked up. (Further time was allowed for the clerk.)

(The videotape continued playing.)

THE COURT: Don't hit anything. Just talk.

A    This again is still looking at the area in which the body was found. That actually is a portion of the skull. This is the body with settlement debris that was on top of it.

(The videotape stopped playing.)

THE WITNESS: I didn't hit nothing.

THE COURT: I know you didn't. It's out again.

THE CLERK: Push the power button on the VCR.

THE COURT: Push the power button on the VCR, she

said, the power button.

THE CLERK: The left side.

THE COURT: The left side.

(The witness complied.)

THE COURT: Brenda, try once more. Just stay over there, until we get through with it.

(The clerk approached the monitor again, and time was allowed for the clerk.)

(The videotape continued playing.)

A    This is the master bedroom and the contents within it.

289

This is a portion of the bed that you see here, ceiling, light fixture and fan above the bed. The drawers, dresser drawers, all -‑

(The videotape stopped playing.)

(Time was allowed for the clerk.)

(The videotape continued playing.)

A    This is the bathroom off the master bedroom, where the dog was found.

And then another shot of the other dresser.

(The videotape stopped playing.)

(Time was allowed for the clerk.)

(The videotape continued playing.)

A This is the mattress that had been throwed off the bed. The bathroom is to our backside now. To our right would be the door. That's debris.

This is the closet area. Still an extension of the fire, how it penetrated to where it did.

This is the actual bedroom across from the master bedroom.

(The videotape stopped playing.)

(The videotape continued playing.)

A    This is the floor in that room, ceiling above the area there. The extension in the fire, as far as, the heat had penetrated, but the actual integrity of the room was still intact.

 290

(The videotape stopped playing.)

THE COURT: Well, just let it go. I think --

THE CLERK: Leave it there?

THE COURT: Yeah. We'll try to get it rescheduled and do it again.

Come back to the witness chair, sir.

(The witness returned to the witness stand, and the jurors returned to their seats.)

Q    Inspector, were you present at the time that the gun was found?

A    Yes, sir, I was.

Q    And drawing your attention to State's Exhibit Number 20, the diagram, can you show where the gun was found in that residence?

A    Yes, sir.

(The witness approached the diagram.)

A    This is the master bedroom. The bed was located in this area here. And it was at the foot of the bed, between the closet and the bathroom and the dresser that you've seen with all the drawers out of it, right here. (Indicated.) (The witness returned to the witness stand.)

(Mr. Panosh showed exhibits to Mr. Lloyd.)

MR. PANOSH: May I approach?

THE COURT: Yes, sir.

Q    In the course of the investigation, you said there was

 291

a measure placed across the hole; is that correct?

A    That is correct.

MR. PANOSH: Seek to introduce 21, measure.

Q    In the course of the investigation of the hole on the subsequent day, what was found there?

A    This was a knife that was removed from that hole.

Q    All right. That would be State's Exhibit 45.

MR. PANOSH: We'd seek to introduce 45.

Q    In the course of the investigation, did you examine the air conditioning unit and the piping?

A    Yes, sir, I did.

Q    And what did you find?

A I found soot and debris and extensive heat and fire damage in the heating and air conditioning system to the house.

Q    And what did that indicate to you?

A    The fire extension was -- the air currents were moving as a result of the mechanical mechanisms of the house.

Q    Okay. And showing you then 38, 39 and 40, do those show the damage to the air conditioning system?

A    Yes, it does.

Q    Thank you.

MR. PANOSH: Seek to introduce those, please.

THE COURT: The Court'll allow the introduction of 38, 39 and 40.

 292

Q    Drawing your attention then to State's Exhibit Number 49, do you recall that particular item, set of keys in the kitchen?

A    Yes, sir.

Q    Okay. And do you know where they were found in the kitchen floor?

A    No, sir.

Q    Okay. State's Exhibit Number 50, what does that show, sir?

A    That shows the fire pattern in the floor that was uncovered as a result of the removal of the debris that was on the floor. It also shows a very distinct pattern as to where the flammable liquids gasoline container was found by the fire department.

Q    Okay.

MR. PANOSH: Seek to introduce 49 and 50, the pictures of the items found on the kitchen floor.

THE COURT: The Court'll allow the introduction.

Q    And 51 is another photograph of the burn pattern in the kitchen; is that correct?

A    That is correct. That's actually an extension of the previous photograph, showing the fire pattern as it was spread throughout the kitchen area.

Okay. Drawing your attention to State's Exhibits 53 and 54, what do they show?

 293

A    Very clear and distinct pouring pattern of flammable liquids throughout the living room of the area.

Q    Okay. And the cones that are placed in there, what are those for?

A    Those for identification purposes, as to where the material that was removed for evidence collection was identified and then photographed.

Q    Okay.

MR. PANOSH: Seek to introduce those, Your Honor.

THE COURT: The Court'll allow the introduction of 53 and 54.

Q    State's Exhibits 55 and 56 shows the exterior of the house, is that correct, on the following day?

A    That is correct.

Q    And 57 through 60, those show the location and the -­that the gun was recovered; is that correct?

A    Yes.

Q    Okay.

MR. PANOSH: We'd introduce 55 through 60, please.

THE COURT: The Court'll allow the introduction of 55 through 60.

Q    Based upon your investigation, did you form an opinion satisfactory to yourself, as an expert in the field of arson investigation, as to whether this was a set fire or an accidental fire?

294

A    Yes, sir, I did.

Q    And what was that opinion?

A    This was most definitely an incendiary fire.

Q    And based upon your investigation, did you determine what the accelerant was?

A    Yes, sir, I did.

Q    And what was that?

A    It was a flammable liquid identified as gasoline.

Q    Now, would you describe the progress of the fire as it burned through this home, based upon your investigation.

A    The initial fire as it ignited was quite a rapid explosion of the vapors within the area. And the material that it -- the pattern in the material in which the flammable material was actually poured on was a continuation of that initial ignition. However, due to the type of construction and the tightness of this house, we become in -- it became a, what we call a smoldering fire. It actually burned very rapid and intense, with a lot of heat, and then actually slowly went back down, seeking out the material that was applied to the residence.

In the course of this, the amount of oxygen that was used available in that time frame was being consumed. The by-product of the fire, the smoke, the gases and the heat, was actually pressurizing this structure, so that it did not allow itself to what we call rapid or free burn. It

 295

actually burned to a hotter intensity, but yet a slower process.

Q    And what, if anything, caused the fire to burn at a more accelerated rate?

A    The actual ignition caused the fire to burn with a rapid intensity, due to the flammable material that was poured on the structure. The immediate explosion was a mass fire fireball, but then the intensity of it died back down, causing it to go back to the point in which it was burning. That's why we have such distinct and clear pour patterns and fire patterns that we found in this structure. Normally, with the amount of materials used, this house should have burned more intense, with more damage. But as a result of that oxygen deficiency, the heat intensity, the gases that were being given off by that fire, it actually suppressed the fire, held it in check, so to speak, until it found another source of that oxygen. Once it did that, it started the reverse process, because the material that was there and was still burning was sufficient to cause the fire to continue. That's why the firefighters, whenever they arrived on the scene, they could see fire underneath, but yet, as they were standing at the back door, they couldn't see fire until they actually penetrated the structure, to extinguish it.

Q    And based upon your investigation, what was that second

296

source of oxygen that caused the fire to burn rapidly again?

A    Without a doubt, the floor area beneath the body giving way and causing the opening of that material in its solid state to become porous allowed the air from beneath the house to actually feed the fire in its generation. As this occurred again, though, the fire, as it burned, actually built in intensity at the point of origin, but it did not consume the entire room -- the entire house, as it may have been designed to do.

Q    When you examined the area where the greatest amount of gasoline was, was there still liquid gasoline present?

A    No, sir.

Q    When you removed the carpet samples, what did you find?

A    When we removed the carpet samples, the odor of gasoline, what we believed to have smelled as like gasoline, was very heavy, very prevalent. It was protected, actually -- the carpet actually beneath the padding and the flooring beneath it acted as a sponge and drew the liquid into it, and did not allow it to release itself, until we uncovered it.

Q    Based upon your examination of this fire, would you say that this fire burned for a long duration?

A    Yes, sir, I would.

MR. PANOSH: No further questions at this time. Thank you.

 297

THE COURT: Mr. Lloyd?

MR. LLOYD: Thank you, Your Honor.

CROSS-EXAMINATION by MR. LLOYD:

Q    Inspector Rich, you first got to the scene here, at Brandon Station Court, looked at the situation, you knew this was arson, didn't you?

A    I had reason to believe it was arson, upon my internal examination of the structure.

Q    Well, you knew that your firefighters had found a gasoline can in the kitchen; is that right?

A    That is correct. They reported that upon my arrival.

Q    All right. And you had this situation where you had this hole burned in the hallway, in the floor system, through the floor joists, you knew that, didn't you? A    I discovered that.

Q    Yes, sir. You don't normally see that in fires of non-set origin, do you?

A    No, sir.

Q    All right. So, as soon as you got on the scene, you were pretty sure that this was arson, weren't you?

A    Upon my examination of the interior of the structure, I_ was able to reach that conclusion.

Q    And as you indicated on direct examination, when you got there, even when you got there, and you -- after the smoke had cleared and all of that, you could smell a strong

298

odor of gasoline, could you not?

A    Once we -- once we removed the carpet, the odor was very prevalent.

Q    Yes, sir. And so, when you first got on the scene, what was the status of the fire at that time?

A    The status of the fire was actually extinguished, as far as the blaze were concerned, but the fire department operation was such that the firemen were still having to go in periodically to extinguish a smolder or an ember or something that may have caught fire. But it was still a very warm and intense heated structure, so at that point, we just stood by and waited till it cooled down, so we could actually go in without protective clothing and without breathing apparatus.

Q    And how long did that take, Inspector Rich?

A    A matter of a couple hours.

Q    And during this time, of course, you were checking out the whole external situation, were you not?

A    That is -- well, yes.

Q    Okay. And during that time, Inspector Rich, did you open up the lid on the gas can and smell, to see if it smelled like gasoline?

A    No, sir, I didn't.

Q    All right. Did you smell the gas can at all, to see if it smelled like gasoline?

299

A    No, sir, I didn't.

Q    Did you do any sort of a lab analysis on it?

A    No, sir, I didn't.

Q    All right. Now, you've indicated that there were -­well, there's been earlier testimony from some of the firemen that they could see smoke coming out of the vent area on the crawl space. Did you inspect those vents in the crawl space?

A    Yes, sir, I did.

Q    Were those vents basically open vents?

A    There were some open, some partially open, some partially closed.

Q    All right. But there were some of them that were open and some of them that were partially open?

A    That's correct.

Q    Which would supply oxygen to at least the crawl space?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. And then when the fire burned down in the crawl space, then they supplied oxygen into the whole house system, from underneath; is that right?

A    In part, that is correct.

Q    All right. Well, some of them were open, and some of them were partially open?

A    That's correct.

And those certainly could supply oxygen into the whole

 300

house system, through the crawl space underneath?

A    Correct.

MR. LLOYD: If I may approach, Your Honor.

THE COURT: You may.

Q    Do you have 50 and 51 up here? Yes, sir. Now, Inspector Rich, showing you what's been marked as State's Exhibit Number 50, that I believe you've already identified as a picture of the fire pattern that you found in the kitchen area; is that correct?

A    It's part of the fire pattern in the kitchen area -‑

Q    Yes, sir.

A    -- that's correct.

Q    And if you could hold that up and show the jury -- when you say "fire pattern" or "pour pattern," if you could show the jury where on the picture that you're talking about, that that's exhibited.

(The witness approached the jury box and held up an exhibit.)

A    Standing at the back door, with the garage to my back, and looking inside of the kitchen, this is after the debris has been moved from the floor area, by the fire service people, as well as myself. So that we could see the floor covering. The floor covering within a room is a very leading indicator as to whether or not a flammable or a liquid had been poured. As a result of that, we were able

 301

to conclude that this in fact was the case here.

(The witness moved to the other end of the jury box.)

A    The dark area furthest from me shows that very clear. It also shows in the very center at the bottom the little, round, clear area, where the firefighters actually found the can that was in the kitchen.

(The witness moved to the other end of the jury box.)

A    There's no reason for a fire to burn down on the floor like this, unless there was an accelerant used.

Q    Thank you, Inspector Rich. Now, Inspector Rich, before you take your seat again, if you could show the jury on the diagram where that area was.

(The witness approached the diagram.)

A    I'm standing right here. You're looking inside the kitchen. Right here is the gas can, and this is part of the pour pattern that you can see in that darked area.

(Indicated.)

Q    And you've spoken about the flooring here in the kitchen. It appeared to be some sort of vinyl flooring to you?

A    That's correct.

Q    All right. And what you've diagrammed -- outlined in red on the diagram there, that basically indicates the -­what you've referred to as the pour pattern, where the gasoline was poured; is that right?

 302

A    Yes, sir.

Q    So, Inspector Rich, there had to be a considerable quantity of gasoline that was poured to start this fire; is that correct?

A    Yes.

Q    And that was consistent with what you found, in terms of the way the fire burned very rapidly, and I believe you used the word almost explosively, initially; is that correct?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. And the floor -- or the pour pattern wound its way through the living room, and into the hallway area? (The witness indicated.)

Q    And that was indicated, as you saw it, on the -- in terms of the -- of what you saw, in terms of the way the fire burned on the floor; is that right?

A    It's a classic example of a pour pattern, 53 and 54.

Q    If you could just hold those up. And I don't think you need to step down in front of the jury, but if you could just do it from the box here.

(The witness held up exhibits.)

A    The lower photograph shows the couch that was in the living room. The pour pattern actually goes from the front of that couch to the seat of that couch, above and beyond the back of that couch, down the hall, to where the body was

 303

found.

The top photograph shows the carpeted area within the living room. Whenever we pull the carpet back, you can actually see there the discoloration in the carpet beneath the top carpet layer, as well as the flooring beneath the carpet. Again, no way for this to have occurred unless there had been an accelerant poured on there and it wicked down into this area. (Indicated.)

Q    And so much accelerant -- so much gasoline, as you've determined the accelerant in this case was used, that when you actually pulled up the carpet samples, the odor of gasoline was very prevalent to you at that time; is that right?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. And the individual who set this fire, Inspector Rich, would have had to pour gasoline all over the pour patterns that you've indicated in red; is that right?

A    That is correct.

Q    And as far as the actual ignition point of the fire, would you be able to say from your investigation, or in your opinion, would it have been in the area close to the back door?

A    No, sir. In this particular case, I believe the ignition source was actually the stove within the kitchen.

Q    All right. And where was the stove located?

 304

A    Right here. (Indicated.)

Q    All right. And before I leave from up here, Detective Rich -- I mean Inspector Rich -- I think you can have your seat now.

(The witness returned to the witness stand.)

Q    If I can find one other picture. Do you have -­(Time was allowed for Mr. Lloyd.)

Q    Showing you what's been marked as State's Exhibit Number 45, what is that, Inspector Rich?

A    Looks like a knife.

Q    All right. And in fact, do you recall finding that knife?

A    No, sir.

Q    All right. You did not find it?

A    No, sir.

Q    Do you remember seeing that knife in the course of your investigation?

A    No, sir.

Q    All right. Were you aware, Inspector Rich, that that knife was found underneath the body in the crawl space?

A    I had information to that effect.

Q    All right. And as far as you're concerned, that was the knife that was found?

A    I have no reason to doubt it.

Q    All right. Okay. But you don't have a specific

 305

recollection of actually finding that knife yourself?

A    I did not find a knife.

Q    All right. Someone else found the knife?

A    Yes, sir.

Q    Inspector Rich, if you know, sir, how much gasoline was left in the can?

A    I do not know.

Q    All right. But there was some gasoline left in it?

A    That's my understanding.

Q    All right. Did you ever check that can, Inspector Rich?

A    No, sir.

Q    All right. Now, on direct examination, you indicated that the -- that there was damage to the heating and air conditioning system of the house?

A    Yes, sir.

Q    All right. And I believe you said that there was -­you found some evidence inside the duct work; is that correct?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. And what did that indicate to you, Inspector Rich?

A    It indicated an intense fire that had been involved with the heating and air conditioning system.

Q    So is -- does that statement mean that the fire

306

actually went into the heating and air conditioning system?

A    Yes, sir, it had to.

Q    All right. As far as you knew, Inspector Rich, was the air conditioning -- heating and/or air conditioning system on at the time?

A    There was indication that it was on, by the mechanical mechanisms within the air handling unit itself.

Q    But of course, when the firemen first came on the scene, they would have cut off the power to the house; is that right?

A    That is a normal firefighting procedure. That's quite common.

Q    All right. And as far as you know, that was done in this case?

A    That is correct.

Q    And did you examine the rest of the system, to determine whether or not it was actually pumping air during the time before the firefighters came?

A    Yes, sir.

Q    Is that an affirmative answer -‑

A    Yes, sir.

Q    -- Mr. Rich?

A    Yes, sir.

All right. And Inspector Rich, just a moment ago, you indicated in your testimony that the ignition point for the

307

fire was the stove; is that right?

A    Quite possibly.

Q    All right. Now, what do you base that opinion on?

A    The eye to the stove was left on, and a combustible material was placed in an abnormal manner on the stove, and in the actual door to the stove, so that a rag could have been left in that area. In fact, we did find residue of that.

Q    Residue of a rag?

A    Yes, sir.

Q    All right. Did you find residue of gasoline that led from the rag to the -- down to the floor?

A    No, sir.

Q    So, how would the fire have gotten from the rag onto the floor and to the gasoline?

A    Gasoline is a volatile liquid. It gives off vapors to minus 45 degrees. So you would have to have a temperature below 45 degrees zero before it would stop giving off those vapors.

As the gasoline was poured throughout the residence, it was continuously boiling off flammable vapors. Any fire -­any ignition source is the only thing that was missing. If we had a fire involved combustible rags and materials left on that stove when the eye was actually on, it would just be a matter of time until the vapor density would build up to

 308

the point that it would reach the level of that stove and/ or that fire. And once it did that, it was total ignition, due to that vapor buildup.

Q    So you're saying that -- well, did you see evidence of some sort of flashpoint ignition, where the vapors in the room ignited?

A    No, sir.

Q    All right. And of course, Inspector Rich, despite the fact that gasoline does give off vapors, gasoline vapors are generally speaking heavier than air, are they not?

A    Yes, sir, they are. That's the reason the time frame and the amount of area that was involved was pertinent.

MR. LLOYD: If the Court would indulge us just for a moment, Your Honor.

THE COURT: Yes, sir.

(Mr. Lloyd and Mr. Hatfield conferred.)

Q    Now, you've indicated on direct examination that in your opinion, Inspector Rich, this fire was -- could well have been of long duration; is that correct?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. In terms of your opinion as to when it started, are you able to put a time on the actual time that it was started, that it was set?

A    With the amount of damage and the nature in which the fire burned, as well as the material which was involved with

 309

that burning process, this was a very lengthy and intense fire over a prolonged period of time. In my opinion, it could have been at least two to three hours, and possibly even longer than that. The floor beneath the body had burned slam through. That takes a long time.

Q    Now, the pour patterns that you observed in the kitchen area, of course, that gasoline was poured over the vinyl flooring in the kitchen; is that right?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. And as you've indicated on the drawing, there was a large amount of gasoline that was poured in that -- as exhibited by the pour patterns?

A    Large is -‑

Q    Is that -‑

A    Large is a relative term. There was enough to go from Point A to Point B.

Q    Yes, sir.

A    As to the exact amount, I really do not have a -‑

Q    But certainly there was enough to spread out to the area that was shown on the burn patterns; is that right?

A    That is correct, yes, sir.

Q    All right. And you would expect, Inspector Rich, that whoever poured that gasoline on the kitchen looked like it was a -- it was not carefully poured, was it? I mean, it wasn't something where -- it looked like it was -- Well,

 310

let me withdraw that question. Looked like to you that the pour patterns were consistent with having been -- the gas having been poured out of that gasoline can that was found in the kitchen; is that correct?

A    I would consider that to be a reasonable assumption.

Q    All right. Thank you, Inspector Rich. And in pouring that gasoline, there could well have been splattering; is that a fair assumption, as well?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. And there could have been splattering on the individual that poured it; is that correct?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. And as you've already noted, gasoline has a propensity to soak into fabrics, and then, as you already testified to, later on, it gives off the characteristic odor of gasoline; is that correct?

A    I'm sorry, counsel. Would you mind repeating that.

Q    Well, as you've already testified, in -- when you pulled up the carpet samples, the characteristic odor of gasoline was given off at that time; is that right?

A    That -- the odor that I know to have been gasoline was observed by me, yes, sir.

Q    All right. Okay. And that's characteristic of fabrics in general, that they will soak up a liquid material like that, and if there is an odor, they will give it off; is

 311

that right?

A    That's quite possible.

Q    Now, you testified on direct examination that there was a set of keys that were found in the kitchen area; is that right?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. And Inspector Rich, if you know, where in the kitchen area were those keys found?

A    I do not know exactly.

Q    All right. Do you know whether or not they were found on the floor or on the counter?

A    I do not know exactly.

Q    All right. Inspector Rich, did you try those keys, in terms of seeing if one of them fit the carport door or the front door or anything like that?

A    No, sir, I did not.

Q    And the gun, were you present when that was found?

A    Yes, sir, I was.

Q    All right. And that was in the master bedroom; is that correct?

A    That is correct -‑

Q    All right.

A    -- at the foot of the bed.

Q    And when you say "the foot of the bed," you mean on the floor, at the foot of the bed?

 312

A    That is correct.

Q    You don't mean inside the bed, do you?

A    No, sir.

Q    Not on the mattress? All right.

A    Actually between the foot of the bed and the bathroom or closet area, on the floor.

Q    All right. And if you could, for the members of the jury, Inspector Rich, if you could just turn to the diagram behind you and mark where that gun was found. If you could just put a little G, to the best of your recollection. There's a pencil there. Yes, sir.

(The witness approached the diagram.)

(Mr. Panosh and Mr. Lloyd conferred.)

Q    Okay. And Mr. Panosh informs me it may be marked.

A    I do not see a G.

Q    All right. If you could mark it where it was found, the best of your recollection.

(The witness complied.)

Q    Thank you, Inspector Rich.

(The witness returned to the witness stand.)

Q    Now, Inspector Rich, the hole where the body was found in the crawl space, in your estimation, how deep was that hole?

A    Totally?

Q    Yes, sir.

313

A    I'm not sure I understand your question.

Q    Just, I mean, in terms of, was it two feet down to the ground, beneath the floor area? Was it three feet?

A    There was sufficient room to crawl beneath the floor of that residence and the ground, so that we were able to crawl up under there and take photographs of the body that was laying on top of the metal duct work that run the length of that hallway. The body had actually fallen down on the duct work, and the duct work had collapsed down on the ground. Two to three feet minimum, maybe even greater.

Q    So the body had not actually fallen down to the bare earth, but was on top of the duct work?

A    That is correct. And it had collapsed the duct work.

Q    All right. Now, Inspector Rich, in terms of where the fire burned through the subflooring, that hole was -- do you have any -- did you make any measurements on the size of that hole?

A    The hole was measured. I did not record the

measurements.

Q    But basically, pretty much took up the -- it was as wide -- just about as wide as the hall space; is that correct?

A    It was actually wider than the hall space.

Q    All right.

A    It –

 314

Q    And as soon as the fire burned through the subflooring, that would have let in -- or that would have exposed the fire, at least from the underside, to oxygen from the crawl space; is that right?

A    That is correct.

Q    And at that time, that would have accelerated the fire?

A    At that point that it broke through, there would be an initial acceleration.

Q    Yes, sir. And as a matter of fact, from that point on, the fire would be supplied with oxygen from the crawl space, which was being fed by the open vents that you've previously testified to?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. So the fire, as soon as it burned through the subflooring, and into the crawl space, had a new source of oxygen, correct?

A    Correct.

Q    All right. And that at that point, as you've already indicated, the fire accelerated?

A    Initially accelerated, once it reached that fresh air input.

Q All right. And at that point, of course, with the fire being accelerated, it started to burn into the joist system, as well?

A    Yes, sir.

 315

Q    All right. And then it spread from that, whatever that initial point was that it burned through the subflooring, it spread outward from that area; is that right?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. With the oxygen supply coming from the crawl space and the open vents; is that correct?

A    Yes, sir.

Q    All right. And so, that part of the fire, that part of the burning, would have been much more rapid than what had preceded up to that time, where the fire was basically smoldering, without a ready source of oxygen, correct? A    Initially, once the fire burned through that subflooring and gotten down to that oxygen, fresh air oxygen, it would have a natural occurrence to intensify in Btu output. But in this particular case, it was burning down, as in most fires and as the law of physics of common chemistry would apply, heat would draw fire up. This is not natural. This is an abnormal occurrence, if you will. Unlike a chimney, this was actually more like a bottle that you were blowing into, because there was no escape hole. The fire in its intensity was not being released into the atmosphere. It was actually being confined and contained in intensity, due to that encapsulation of that residence. Q    But, of course, you did have this oxygen inflow from -­for example, you had a vent on one side of the house that

 316

was open, you had a vent on the other side of the house that was open, so you would have a cross-ventilation over the fire at that point; is that right?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. So the fire could have burned laterally certainly?

A    Excuse me. That statement is not actually correct. It did not burn over the fire; it actually burned beneath the fire.

Q    All right.

A    And quite possibly laterally.

Q    Okay. But at any rate, you had oxygen, you had an air source from one side of the building, to the other side of the building, and the fire could have certainly burned laterally at that point?

A    Correct.

Q    Regardless of which side it came in from?

A    Correct.

Q    All right. And so, you had this intensification of the fire, due to the air input from the vents and the crawl space? Well, let me ask you this, Inspector Rich. You didn't run any tests on how long it would take for a floor joist to burn, even from the top to the bottom, in that house, with the vents as they were at that time, did you?

A    I did not conduct any tests, no, sir.

 317

Q    All right. Okay. So you don't know how long that would have taken?

A    I know, based on my experience within the field of fire investigation, as to the opinion as to how long it took.

Q    But you -- but that's -- but -- Okay. But every system is different, because you're talking about how much oxygen you're getting into the system, what the heat parameters are, and all those other factors that go into determining how fast the fire burns; is that correct?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. And you didn't measure those in this csae, in terms of this house in particular, did you?

A    I measured it based on my observations of the damage that was done, but chemistry -- by measurements of what degree? I'm not sure what the question really is.

Q    Well, you didn't measure the oxygen input into the system, you didn't set up some sort of system to see how much air infiltration you had, even with the hole in the floor, in the crawl space, did you?

A    No, sir -‑

Q    All right.

A    -- did not do that.

Q    And in terms of the entire air infiltration, until the house -- even before the fire burned through the crawl space, you didn't make a measurement on what kind of air

 318

infiltration the house was getting at that time, did you?

A    Nothing other than my observations.

Q    All right. Okay.

MR. LLOYD: Thank you, inspector. That's all I have.

THE COURT: Mr. Panosh, any additional questions?

MR. PANOSH: Yes.

REDIRECT EXAMINATION by MR. PANOSH:

Q    Inspector, were you present when the firefighters testified that upon initial arrival, they looked in and could not see any open flames?

A    Yes, sir, I was.

Q    And what does that indicate to you?

A    A very intense fire with a lot of smoldering, as a result of the fire burning. It's not a free-burning fire at that point.

Q    So even after the fire had burned through and dropped to the -- burned through the floor and had dropped down, you would not characterize it as a free-burning fire?

A    No, sir. I would at that point characterize it as a very starved fire, for lack of sufficient oxygen to continue to burn.

Q    Based upon your observations there at the fire scene and your investigation of the structure, could you tell when, in terms of the length of the fire, the body actually

 319

fell through the floor?

A    It would be rather lengthy, in times of ignition, to the point that the flooring give away and actually allowed the floor to collapse with the body on it.

Q    Now, the two-by-ten flooring was completely burned through before the body could fall; is that correct?

A    That is correct.

Q    You were asked if -- to speculate on the manner that this gasoline was poured. Did you find any physical evidence that would indicate that there was spattering on the person who was pouring the gasoline?

A    In my opinion, there was.

Q    And where was that?

A    All over the body.

Q    Let me try this again. Not on the deceased. The question is -‑

A    I'm sorry. I misunderstood the question.

Q    Did you find any physical evidence at the scene of the crime to indicate that the person who was pouring the gasoline spilled the gasoline on himself?

A    No.

Q When you were asked if it could have happened that the gasoline spattered on the person pouring the gasoline, that was speculation; is that right?

A    That's correct.

320

Q    You were asked about the air conditioning system and whether or not it was functioning. Do you know at what point it stopped functioning?

A    Yes, sir, it did. At what point, no, sir. It would have to be on the -- after the initial ignition of the fire.

Q    Because there was damage to the interior?

A    That is correct.

Q    In the event that the air conditioning system was pumping air, it would have been pumping the air from the inside of the house; is that correct?

A    That is correct.

Q    And the air that had been pumping back in would have been oxygen-deprived air; is that correct?

A    Yes, it would have been, at that point.

Q    Based upon your training and experience as an arson investigator, would the fact that the air conditioning was running and recirculating the oxygen-deprived air, would that in any way accelerate the fire?

A    Initially it would have an impact on the fire, but I think that duration would have been short-lived, due to the intensity and the location of the return vent air supply.

Q    So it would have had a very short duration?

A    Initially.

Q    Now, inspector, you made some comments about the stove.
MR. PANOSH: May I approach the witness?

321

THE COURT: Yes, sir.

MR. PANOSH: Do you have my last number to be 60?

THE CLERK: Yes, sir. 61 would be your next number.

MR. PANOSH: 61? Thank you.

Q    I'll show you now what's been marked as State's Exhibits 61 through 67. Would you take a look at those, please. Do you recognize those, sir?

A    Yes, sir, I do.

Q    Are those photographs of the stove that you've previously indicated was in the kitchen area?

A    That is correct.

Q    And would you explain to the ladies and gentlemen of the jury what your -‑

MR. PANOSH: We'd move to introduce those into evidence, please, Your Honor.

THE COURT: The Court'll allow the introduction of State's Exhibits 61 through 67.

Q    Would you explain your findings in reference to the stove and using those photographs, and could you step before the jury.

MR. PANOSH: May he step before the jury, Your Honor?

THE COURT: He may.

(The witness approached the jury box.)

322

A    This was an electrical stove that was in the kitchen. What we're showing here -‑

THE WITNESS: Let me lay these out, if you don't mind.

(The witness placed exhibits on the jury rail and held up some exhibits.)

A    What you can see here is the knobs that control or are the controls for the electrical eyes on the stove. You can see that one is in a position that it would have to be on in this position.

(The witness moved to the other end of the jury box and held up exhibits.)

A    These are two photographs taken at different positions, showing the combustible material that we found that was between the oven door and the eyes on top of the stove.

It's the corner of the door in which you can see. It looks like a rope right here, but it actually was a larger piece of cloth. It's just been burned to the size that you see here.

(The witness moved to the other end of the jury box.)

Q    Now, would you explain to the ladies and gentlemen of _ the jury how it was those observations led to the findings in which you said that a possible ignition point was the stove.

A    If this were a fire on top of the stove, and the

 323

flammable vapors that were being given off as a result of the fire -- or the liquid being poured onto the floor, as it released those vapors, the intensity level for the ignition rise, and once it reached that point that the fire was at, you had the ignition. (Snapped fingers.)

Q    Inspector, could you tell the ladies and gentlemen of the jury what would occur if there was a flammable item, such as a rag, placed on top an electric eye when the stove switches are in the position that you've demonstrated.

A    At the point in which the temperature was sufficient, it would have ignited.

Q Now, you've indicated that when the flammable liquid was poured throughout the kitchen, it would begin to give off gasoline vapors and those vapors would bank up?

A    That is correct.

Q    Would there be a delay between the time the gasoline was poured and the time that that banking vapors reached the top of the stove, as you've indicated?

A    That is correct.

Q    And would that be a delay, in terms of minutes or in terms of hours or -‑

A    Minutes.

Q    And based upon those findings, you listed the stove as a possible point of the ignition; is that correct?

A    That is correct.

 324

Q    Are there other possible points of ignition?

A    Yes, there are.

Q    And what would those be?

A    Any electrical switch that would be throwed off on, if it were in the flammable range, it would ignite -- an electrical motor that would start up, for example, on the refrigerator, quite common, they're down low. It would take an ignition source such as that, though, to ignite it, that or a match.

Q    And when you say "that or a match," what do you mean?

A    Free-burning fire sufficient to, in heat intensity to ignite those vapors.

Q    Is there anything in your findings that would prevent -- that would indicate that it would be -- not be possible for a person to have ignited that gasoline from the area of the kitchen door?

A    No, sir.

Q    And that could have been done with a free-burning source, such as a match; is that correct?

A    That is correct.

Q    So those are two possible points of ignition; is that correct, sir?

A    That is correct.

(The witness returned to the witness stand.)

MR. PANOSH: Your Honor, I'd like to stop and see

325

if I can get that videotape working in the morning for him.

THE COURT: All right, sir.

You may step down, Mr. Rich.

(The witness left the witness stand.)

THE COURT: Members of the jury, we'll take our evening recess. You need to be back in the morning at 9:30. Please report to the jury room. Please remember the juror responsibility sheet as to what your conduct should be like.

Have a nice evening. I'll see you in the morning at 9:30.

(The jury left the courtroom at 4:55 p.m.)

THE COURT: Any other matters before the evening recess?

MR. PANOSH: No, Your Honor.

THE COURT: For the defense?

MR. LLOYD: No, Your Honor.

THE COURT: 9:30 in the morning, sheriff.

(A recess was taken at 4:56 p.m. until 9:30 a.m. Wednesday, August 12, 1998.)

332

WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 12, 1998

(Court convened at 9:34 a.m. The defendant was present. The jury was not present.)

THE COURT: Any matters we need to take care of before I bring the jury in?

MR. PANOSH: Two quick things, Your Honor. The clerk pointed out to me State's Number 3 has not been admitted. We move that at this time.

THE COURT: Which exhibit's that, sir?

MR. PANOSH: That's the memorandum of the telephone calls.

MR. HATFIELD: We --

THE COURT: That was not admitted. The Court will not admit that.

MR. PANOSH: Will not?

THE COURT: No, sir.

MR. PANOSH: Okay.

And we have a different tape player, and the tape's ready to go.

THE COURT: Okay.

(The jury entered the courtroom at 9:35 a.m.)

THE COURT: Very pleased to have the jury panel back. I hope each of you had a nice evening and feeling okay. Anyone experiencing any problems this morning that I should know about, if you'd raise your hand, I'll be glad to

333

talk with you about that.

I think we have a different machine, and we're going to try again on the video.

The State ready to proceed? Mr. Panosh, are you ready to proceed?

MR. PANOSH: Yes, sir.

THE COURT: Do you want to continue?

MR. PANOSH: Your Honor, we'd ask Mr. Ed Rich to return to the stand and narrate the video.

THE COURT: You're still under oath, sir.

(The witness, Edward Rich, and Mr. Panosh approached the television monitor, and the witness continued playing the videotape, State's Exhibit Number 48, to the jury.)

EDWARD RICH, having been previously duly sworn, testified as follows during CONTINUED REDIRECT EXAMINATION by MR. PANOSH:

A    All right. This is the interior of the house, where the body was found, and showing again the burned and charred debris as it was present at the time.

That's the ladder over the hole that we talked about yesterday.

This is the master bedroom.

That's the master bath.

This is showing just an overall view of the master bath -- or bedroom. And that's the closet out of that same room. This is actually the bedroom across the hall from the

334

master bedroom, at the end of that hall.

This is the same area, showing the materials that were in there was just in a disarray. All the files were open, pulled out. You can see everything's sort of strewn around. It's not organized.

Okay. This is the ceiling above the hall. This indicates to me that the fire was contained within that space. It did not, as we would normally consider a fire, ventilate or open up to the outside. It was well contained within this area.

THE WITNESS: I'm sorry. This is the first time I've ever used this machine. I hit the back-up button, rather than the pause again.

A    Now, at this point, this is several hours into my arrival. A lot of investigative information has been looked at, as far as the fire scene, as to what had happened. But there is a need to remove the victim within this case at this point. The gentleman here to our back is the transport unit that will actually transport the body.

What we're going to do now is take whatever debris that is on top of the victim, and we're going to, what we call off-layer it. As things fall down and as things fall on top, that's a layering effect, so we're going to remove this. And this is a very slow process, and I'm not sure exactly how much time is on this, but it takes awhile. You

335

don't want to disturb anything. You want to see that everything is under normal conditions expected to be there. What we're looking for here is anything abnormal that shouldn't have been here, with the exception, of course, of the body.

Actually, at this point, we're actually looking for extension of the fire, as to how far it did extend, because it did extend laterally some, but it wasn't very much, two to three feet at the most, beyond the opening itself, which again, very concentrated, very locally-contained fire.

That's the ironing board that was at the closet just adjacent to the hallway, the laundry room area.

This is actually the body itself, this dark, charred area. (Indicated.) I know it's a little hard to pick out here. But this straight line is a duct, metal duct that is normally found in households for heating and air conditioning systems. The body is laying on top of the duct. So you can see all of this area in here on the floor. On the outside edges, you can see the extension of the fire.

This is actually a washer or a dryer that's laid down in the edge of the hole.

This is a -- the master bedroom's back this way. The kitchen and hall -- or the kitchen and living room is to the bottom of this particular photograph. (Indicated.) We're actually looking in a westward direction, down the hall.

336

We're going to take a sheet and lay over the body, so we're going to try and roll it over and protect it when we move this material out, so anything else won't fall down there and damage the body any more. As well as, we'll use that sheet later to help us remove the body.

This is ID Tech Roy Lindell who's there assisting with this operation.

If you can see this area right here, this is actually the floor support that supports the covering and the subflooring to a house. (Indicated.) This is what we call the floor joist. Right up under here, up under that floor joist, is actually a cinder block pillar, which they build up out of the ground, to hold and support the structure, the residence.

This item right here, this long pipe, is actually a PVC pipe that's been charred as a result of the fire. (Indicated.) You can see the distance here. This to me is a clue or a signal or a red flag, or whatever you want to describe, as something that, this distance is within this amount of space. (Indicated.) It's not very far at all. This is plumbing to the bathroom and the laundry room that was there. But yet, it was sufficient heat generated to char and to burn not just this one that we see here with the remains, but every one the entire length of that opening. But yet, it didn't burn the PVC pipe within two foot of it.

337

It charred it and discolored it, but it didn't burn it. And why? Heat rises.

Our objective at this point is to be sure and get all the parts.

Those flashes every once in a while, we're taking still photographs also at this point.

The body has been in fact rolled over onto the sheet now and we're removing it.

MR. LLOYD: Your Honor, we would renew our objections, that these pictures of the body being removed are simply to inflame the passions of the jury.

THE COURT: The Court's already ruled on that. Mr. Panosh, if you'd stop it where the Court told you to stop it.

MR. PANOSH: Yes, sir.

A    At this point, we're actually looking for anything that would help us identify who this is, jewelry, any type of clothing articles or pierced, you know, earrings of that type.

Q    Okay. You can stop it and turn it off.

(The witness complied.)

(The witness returned to the witness stand.)

Q    Can you step back before the jury.

MR. PANOSH: May he step before the jury, Your Honor?

338

THE COURT: You may.

(The witness approached the jury box.)

Q    Showing you now what has been previously marked as State's Exhibit 17. Be careful not to turn your back on the jurors. Drawing your attention to this, what's that right here? (Indicated.)

A    This is a firefighter that was standing on the floor.

Q    All right. And the area immediately below his boots is what?

A    Immediately below his boots is the charred debris of the floor that was still intact.

Q    And this -‑

(The bailiff moved the television monitor unit to the side of the courtroom.)

MR. PANOSH: Before you take it out, we need to remove the tape, okay?

THE BAILIFF: That's fine.

MR. PANOSH: Thank you.

Q    So this area between these two lines is what, sir?

A    That's the floor joist that supports the subflooring in the house.

Q    And this -‑

THE COURT: You might like to move down to the other side. The other jurors on the end can't see it.

MR. PANOSH: Yes. If it's all right, I'm going to

339

repeat it.

THE COURT: All right, sir. That's fine.

Q    And this line that comes through here is what, sir? (Indicated.)

A    I'm having trouble focusing my bifocals. That's actually the metal duct work that's supporting the heating and air conditioning system.

Q    Now, the two-by-tens that ran ran this way in that hallway; is that correct? (Indicated.)

A    That would have been correct.

Q    And there were a number of them across this opening; is that correct?

A    That is correct.

Q    And they're normally spaced 16 inches?

A    That is correct.

Q    And they were completely destroyed by the fire?

A    Correct.

Q    Come down here and please repeat your testimony. I'll just let you go through it.

A    Okay.

(The witness moved to the other end of the jury box.)

A    This is the firefighter who was standing. His back would have actually been to the kitchen. We're looking at the hallway, which would be to the west, to the rear master bedroom, down towards the living room and the kitchen. The

340

firefighter is actually standing on the floor of the hallway that is right at the point between the kitchen and -- I mean, excuse me, the living room and the hallway, where it begins. What he is standing on is the debris that has burned and fallen down, as well as the flooring beneath him is still supporting his weight. Beneath that is the actual interior structure of the residence that supports that full load, as well as him being on it.

Between this point of his foot and back beyond the photograph here, every 16 inches on center normally is a residential construction, those two-by-tens would have been there to support that same floor.

This shows the amount of -- and the degree at which the fire burned and the concentration of that fire, which is that immediate area, by being able to destroy those support structures. (Indicated.)

Q    You can resume your seat. Thank you.

(The witness returned to the witness stand.)

Q    But the two-by-ten that we saw the fireman standing on top of was not consumed?

A    It was not consumed.

Q    And the reason was?

A    Simply by time and temperature, with this being the case, the amount of time and temperature it reached didn't totally consume it. You can see though that it was in the

341

immediate area of the fire, by the depth of charring, what we refer to as alligatoring. It's that rippling effect as to how combustible material actually is being destroyed by the heat of the fire.

Q    And again, this would be examples -- example of the fact that the fire did not spread laterally; is that correct?

A    No, sir. That acts as in fact a barrier, to keep the heat from being spread beyond that point. The heat would have had to go down and then back up and do that continuously.

Q    When you were looking -- or showing the ladies and gentlemen of the jury the removal of the body, which way on the diagram were her feet pointed?

(The witness approached the diagram.)

Q    And if you could pick up a red -- or I mean a, perhaps a blue marker and just do a stick figure, indicating where her feet and head were.

A Okay. The drawing indicates this is north and this is south. (Indicated.) Her head was laying towards the master bedroom area, with her feet extending from that, of course. (Drew on the diagram.)

Q    Thank you, sir.

(The witness returned to the witness stand.)

Q    At the point that you were showing the ladies and

342

gentlemen of the jury the ceiling above the hole, you said, "This indicates to me that the fire was contained." Would you explain that in more detail, please.

A    The heat generated from a fire that's burning has a natural tendency to go up and out. As that effect or as that heat is being released from any point of the fire, it's going to have a fall-down effect, if it can't go on up into the atmosphere. Whatever obstruction would be in there would retain that heat and contain it, to the point that that material, whatever it be, whether it's the ceiling, whether it's the ceiling rafters, the insulation, or the roof itself, in fact, whatever point that gives way, as a result of the amount of temperature that's being generated from that fire, until it does do that, it's going to retain, it's going to suppress the heat. It's going to suppress the gases. It's going to actually do the reverse of the natural currents or the natural tendencies of the fire to occur. With combustible materials, it should -- as long as there's heat, fuel and oxygen, the fire will continue to burn. The amount and the degree in which those three elements will play into the fire will be the determining factor as to how long it will burn.

This fire did not penetrate the ceiling of this house. The ceiling was intact. The heat from the fire did penetrate the ceiling, through cracks, crevices, that

343

evolved as the process of the house being destroyed. The nails within or screws within the stud walls, the ceiling, act as a magnet, if you will, to conduct that heat transfer. Quite often, this is what we can have to cause a fire to extend beyond the room of origin, allowing that fire to continue to consume and burn, because it breaks that barrier, it breaks that shell, if you will, breaks it down.

This didn't happen here. Once that heat generated and once that heat built up, the pressure from the fire suppressed it, kept it low, kept it at a moderate, what I would consider to be a moderate level of temperature of burn, and actually in effect suppress the fire to the point that it was still burning. The fire burned from the point of ignition, until the point at which the fire department arrived to put it out, no question.

The degree of that burning, the amount of time and temperature that it took to do that burning, was quite a long period of time. The structure itself never ventilated, what we call ventilated to the atmosphere. A window didn't break out, a door didn't give away, those type of things which normally accelerate a fire, because you've got to have as much energy released as you do, to continue to burn.

That was what I meant by that statement.

MR. PANOSH: Thank you. No further questions.

THE COURT: Cross-examination?

344

MR. LLOYD: Thank you, Your Honor.

RECROSS-EXAMINATION by MR. LLOYD:

Q    Inspector Rich, let me ask you some questions about something you testified to yesterday, when Mr. Panosh asked you. The rag that was found in State's Exhibit -- or is shown in State's Exhibits 67 and 66, did you check that rag for accelerants?

(Mr. Lloyd handed exhibits to the witness.)

A    No, sir.

Q    All right. And you indicated that, according to your theory, that the rag, if it were in contact with a burn, at some point it could have ignited and provided the ignition for the fire to start; is that correct?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. Now, the rag, of course -- and if you could just hold it up to the jury and show the jury -- is located in the oven door; is that right?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. And I believe you indicated that one of the knobs on the burners showed that it was in the on position; is that right?

A    That's my understanding.

Q    All right. And I show you what's been marked as State's Exhibit Number 64. And is that the knob that you're referring to? You can look at the other pictures, if you

345

want to get your bearings, Inspector Rich.

A    Yeah, let me do that.

Q    Yes. By all means.

(Time was allowed for the witness.)

A    Yes, sir, it is.

Q    All right. And that is the burner to the right rear unit, is it not?

A    As we're standing facing the oven, yes, sir.

Q    In fact, it says, and you can see it in the photograph, "Rear" underneath that picture of the knob itself, right?

A    That is correct.

Q    And it shows you a little -- there's a little diagram above the knob, which shows you that the burner that it relates to, and it's darkened, it's got a little grid, and shows you that we're talking about the right rear, as you're facing the stove; is that right?

A    That's my understanding.

Q    All right. And if you could just step down and show the jury this photograph, and indicate where the lettering that shows "Rear" is and the little diagram which shows that that would be the right rear.

(The witness approached the jury box.)

A    This is the knob that's in question right at this point. (Indicated.) Beneath this, I know you can't see it, but I can read it, it says "Rear." And above that, there's

346

a little pictorial diagram, as to how the eyes of the stove that's laid out. And on that, I can see the four eyes, with one being dark or has a solid dot. The others are just simply a circle. To me, that says the eye is on, and would be an indicator as to which eye it was that was on. (The witness moved to the other end of the jury box and indicated.)

Q    Thank you, Inspector Rich.

(The witness returned to the witness stand.)

Q Now, Inspector Rich, you did not see any rag that led from the right rear burner to this rag that's shown on the stove door, did you? (Indicated.)

A    No, sir.

Q    All right. And you also did not -- you did not see any accelerant that was poured on the front of the stove door; is that correct?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. And saw no evidence of any accelerant, a pour path or anything like that, on the door?

A    No, sir.

Q    All right. Or on the top of the stove unit -‑

A    No, sir.

Q    -- as well? Now, Inspector Rich, you're aware that it is a code requirement that hot water heaters be placed 18 inches above the floor of whatever -- for example, if

347

they're put in a garage, if a hot water heater is put in a garage, it's a code requirement that it be elevated 18 inches; is that right?

THE WITNESS: Your Honor, I need a point of clarification as to the definition of his garage.

Q    All right. Well, you -- if you don't understand the question, I'll repeat it. Is it a code requirement that the hot water heater in say a garage area be located 18 inches off the floor?

A    Are you speaking of residential?

Q    Yes, sir, yes, sir, residential.

A    I'm sorry. I do not have jurisdiction or knowledge as to the residential building code.

Q    All right. Well, are you aware, Inspector Rich, that the purpose of that, if it is a code requirement, is so that gasoline fumes, if they're present, won't rise to the height-where a pilot light might be, or a contact that kicks the hot water heater on might create a spark?

MR. PANOSH: Objection, please.

THE COURT: Overruled, if he knows.

A    If I understand your question --

Q    Yes, sir.

A    -- with regards to the flammable vapors, and any electrical service within that space, that would be correct.

Q    Okay. And the purpose in such a rule is so that you

348

won't have those flammable vapors being ignited by a pilot light or a contact switch that creates a spark; is that right?

A    That is correct.

Q    And you don't dispute that the code requires that that height be only 18 inches?

A    No, sir.

Q    All right. The code doesn't require that it be 30 inches or 36 inches, as far as you know?

A    I really don't know what the residential code does

require.

Q    All right. Is there a similar requirement in the commercial code?

A    Yes, sir, there is.

Q    All right. And is that 18 inches in the commercial code?

A    18 inches minimum.

Q    All right.

A    You cannot place any electrical appliance within that

space.

Q    But if you did place it 18 inches, you would be within code?

A    No, sir. You'd have to place it beyond the 18 inches.

Q    That's what I mean.

349

Q    If you placed it at 19 inches, for example -‑

A    Theoretically, yes, sir.

Q    -- you're within the code?

A    Yes, sir.

Q    And you don't have to move it up to 30 inches, do you?

A    No, sir.

Q    You don't have to move it up to the height of a stove, do you?

A    Now, we are speaking with regards to electrical outlets?

Q    Yes, sir.

A    Yes, sir.

Q    Anything that might create a spark?

A    No, sir, not anything.

Q    All right. Now, the couch that we've seen in several of the photographs, that had the gasoline poured straight over the top of it, didn't it?

A    Yes, sir, it did.

Q    All right. And you could see that by the burn pattern?

A    That's correct.

Q    And it went over the front of it and down the back of it; is that right?

A    That's correct.

Q    Now, Inspector Rich, in the course of your investigation, did you take note of any pry marks on the

350

kitchen door, around the door latch and the lock area? A    It was brought to my attention that there had been previous damage to that, yes.

Q    And you noted that there were pry marks?

A    I did not make a physical note of it. I do recall that, though.

Q    All right. Do you recall seeing those yourself?

A    Yes.

Q    All right. And these are the kind of pry marks that would be, as far as you were concerned, they would be consistent with a chisel or a crowbar or a large screwdriver, if you remember, Inspector Rich?

A    The floor -- the -- Excuse me. The door had damage to it. As to what could have caused it, I really don't know.

Q    All right. Okay. Did you note damage marks to the doorjamb, as well?

A    Yes.

Q    All right. And those were visible to you?

A    Yes.

Q    All right. And those would have been consistent with some sort of prying or something of that sort?

A    It would have had to have been, in my opinion.

Q    All right. And you know, of course, Inspector Rich, and you've talked to the fire personnel who were first on the scene, they did not -- they just simply opened the door;

351

is that correct?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. So these marks would have been consistent with some kind of forced entry?

A    One could assume that.

Q    All right. Now, in the video, we saw a tool chest, and that was located in the master bedroom, correct?

A    No, sir.

Q    All right. Where was that located, inspector?

A    It was located in the bedroom across the hall from the master bedroom.

Q    And that was a double-tiered tool chest, so that you had a bottom, and then a smaller chest on top of it?

A    That is correct.

Q    A large tool chest?

A    Yes, sir.

Q    Did you attempt to move that tool chest, Inspector Rich?

A    Only from the standpoint of maybe moving it left to right or something to that nature.

Q    But it was a heavy item, was it not?

A    Oh, yes, definitely.

Q    All right.

A    It was what I would consider to be a commercial mechanics tool chest.

352

Q    All right. Now, you indicated in your testimony yesterday that, in terms of how long the fire had burned before the fire department put it out, that in your opinion, the fire could have been burning for two hours; is that correct?

MR. PANOSH: Object.

THE COURT: Sustained.

Q    Was that your opinion, that the fire burned for some two hours?

A    I believe I said that the fire would have burned, in my opinion, anywhere from two to three hours and possibly longer.

Q    All right. So -- I don't mean to try to limit you, I was just -- I just -- two to three hours is what you said, possibly longer?

A    That's correct.

Q    But that was your -- based on your investigation in this case?

A    That's correct.

Q    So it certainly wouldn't -- if it came to your attention that it could somehow be proved how long the fire burned, and it turned out it would be two hours, that's not inconsistent with your opinion, is it?

A    No.

Q    Okay. Now, you indicated yesterday, Inspector Rich,

353

that at the time the fire was burning when the fire department arrived, that was basically at a moderate level; is that correct? Is that a fair statement of what you said?

A    That is correct.

Q    All right. But there were flames present? You heard the testimony of Fireman Faulk, testified that he could see an area in the crawl space looked, I believe he described it as a campfire?

A    I'm not sure what he described it as, but I remember the statement being made about the flames being visible.

Q    All right.

MR. LLOYD: That's all I have, Your Honor.

FURTHER REDIRECT EXAMINATION by MR. PANOSH:

Q    Sir, when you first inspected the stove, was the stove door open or closed?

A    Closed.

Q    In reference to the rag that you hypothesized may have been on the back burner, did it need an accelerant to ignite?

A    No, sir.

Q    Once it ignited, what would be left?

A    Virtually nothing, because it would still be on top of the eye, and the eye would be in the on position, so it would have eventually been totally consumed.

Q    And there would be some ash?

354

A    Quite possible.

Q    And that was in the area that was exposed to the fire hoses; is that correct?

A    Oh, yes. That was in direct line of contact, as far as the entry of the fire service.

Q    Now, you had a series of questions in reference to the code. Based upon the information elicited by counsel, is there anything that changes your opinion that these vapors could have banked up to the top of that stove?

A    Absolutely not.

Q    Would you explain why the code is 18 inches, if you know.

A    Not in a residential, I'm not prepared to do that. I could address that from a commercial standpoint.

Q    Please do.

A    The 18 inches is in effect because of the history of the fire service experiencing fires within commercial garages, in which various flammable materials have been conducted. Quite often, we'll have mechanics that are using what we call the old trouble light. This is a single light unit that he or she is up there working on the car. Quite often this is a fuel with a flammable gasoline that he's involved with. We've actually had fires to have started from utilizing equipment like this. And therefore, the codes have been able to implement this level of protection

355

for that repair service person.

Because the nature and the characteristics of this flammable accelerant is in fact heavier than air, and the vapor densities will suppress any release, so that it has to go down, seek the lower level as to what area it's in, in this case, a garage floor. And as it does that, it spreads out laterally. This is something you and I can't see, but in fact, the vapors do do this. When it does this, it hits the walls of the surrounding area that the release has occurred in, and then it starts actually building back or banging back to the point it's still going to give off, that gasoline is minus 45 degrees. Nothing's going to stop that in this area.

So it's continuously releasing these vapors. And as long as this -- the liquid is there, it's going to continue to build. And 18 inches is actually a compromise, you know. The safest thing would be to just remove it, but that's not a practicality. But it's felt within that space that it's sufficient amount of time for any technician to be able to adequately clean up the spill or the liquid involved.

Q    Or ventilate the area?

A    Or ventilate the area, correct. You've got to remove those vapors. Those are the explosive things that cause fires.

Q    You were asked about the doorjamb and the door, and you

356

indicated that it was brought to your attention that was previous damage. What did you mean?

A    The reports that I recall were that the house had been reportedly broken into, by the previous records checks with the sheriff's department.

MR. PANOSH: May I approach?

Q    You were asked about a tool chest and asked to describe the tool chest. Showing you State's 25, does that show a tool chest?

A    Yes.

Q    And what's on the bottom of the tool chest?

A    I'm sorry, counsel?

Q    What's at the bottom of the tool chest? Let me ask you this. Does it have wheels?

A    Yes. I'm sorry.

Q    All right.

A    I took that to be a common known. It's one of those mechanic types you see in a commercial garage, that they roll around. There are in fact wheels attached to the chest.

Q    Based upon your experience and your observations of that tool chest, would an average size individual have any difficulty moving it, regardless of how many tools were in it?

A        No, not really.

357

MR. PANOSH: No further questions. Thank you, sir.

THE COURT: Additional questions, Mr. Lloyd?

MR. LLOYD: Yes, sir.

FURTHER RECROSS-EXAMINATION by MR. LLOYD:

Q    Inspector Rich, an average size individual would certainly have problems moving it over a doorjamb, wouldn't they?

A    Over a doorjamb?

Q    Uh-huh.

A    Those are pretty big castors. I'm sure they'd have -­you know, depending on how the load of the chest was -‑

Q    Uh-huh.

A    -- with tools. But an average size, in my opinion, could move it, certainly, over the doorjamb.

Q Well, there was a drop between the garage area and the main body of the house there at the kitchen door, was there not?

A    There -- that is correct.

Q    All right. Well, let me ask you more specifically. Average size individual, do you think he would have difficulty in moving, transversing that area through the kitchen door, out into the garage area?

A    I would say so, yes.

Q    All right. Now, you indicated that, according to your

358

theory, Detective Rich, that the banking of the gasoline could have taken place in this case and caused some sort of spontaneous ignition. When would that have taken -- how long, in your estimation, would that have taken, for that banking to take place?

A    The gasoline is not the banking issue. Gasoline is the liquid that was poured on the -‑

Q    Yes, sir.

A    -- area. The vaporization -‑

Q    Yes, sir.

A    -- that occurred as a result of that gasoline, what's commonly referred to as boiling off, is being given by the release of that liquid turning into a gas. That process is immediate, it's continuous, it never quits, until minus 45 degrees. So nowhere in this area is that not going to be the case. The amount of release would certainly be directly related to the amount of confinement. If it's in a tank, if it's in a can, if the lid's on it. As that area is involved size-wise would be more intense, more of a release. If you would spread this out, you spread a liquid out, so it's going to vaporize, it's going to turn into a gas much more readily, than if it were concentrated in a small container.

As far as a time frame within the fire being on top of the stove, and those gasoline vapors from the floor being released into that area, it's within minutes. It's

359

certainly not beyond hours. That's as close as I can give you.

Q    All right. Well, Inspector Rich, let me ask you this. We're all clear on the concept that these gasoline vapors are heavier than air, right?

A    I'm clear.

Q    All right. And you've testified to that?

A    Yes, sir.

Q    All right. So is it your testimony then that, based on the gasoline that was poured on the floor, that these vapors would bank up to such an extent that they would reach the height of the burn within 10 minutes?

A    With the area involved, 10 minutes might be a little soon. It should, in my opinion, take a little longer than 10 minutes.

Q    So is it your testimony then that, even though these vapors are heavier than air, and their natural tendency is going to go sink to the bottom, that within 30 minutes, are they going to be banked up, according to your theory, sufficiently high to be at the same level as the top of the stove?

A    I would think within that time frame, you're getting very, very close.

Q    All right. So do you think it would take 30 minutes, according to your theory?

360

A    It's possible.

Q    All right. You do think it would take longer than 30 minutes?

A    It's possible.

Q    In your experience, not as a fire inspector, just as a homeowner, Inspector Rich, how long does it take a burner on a stove to reach red hot?

MR. PANOSH: Well, he should be asked as an expert, Your Honor.

MR. LLOYD: Well, I'll –-

THE COURT: If he knows.

MR. LLOYD: If he knows.

THE WITNESS: I'm sorry. I didn't understand the

ruling.

THE COURT: You may answer the question, if you have knowledge or have an opinion in that area.

A    A matter of minutes.

Q    All right.

MR. LLOYD: That's all I have, Your Honor.

THE COURT: You may step down, sir.